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 Post subject: -Hardw ECC recovered- and -Seek error rate- growingFAST
PostPosted: May 24th, 2017, 11:53 
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ST3160815AS, this hdd it's working fine, have a Read speed of 76MB/s and Write 50MB/s, but when i check the SMART with VICTORIA and MHDD get this attributes

-Seek error rate-----------------58721051 and growing
-Hardware ECC recovered-------206385178 and growing

Both attributes on Copy or readings increases. My knowledge says when this kind or read error occurs could be:
1- a defective cable
2- dirty PCB
3- defective on the computer motherboard
4- a High Macnetic Field due a Fan or magnet close to the PCB or the cable

For this 4 posibilities i have done this:
1- change the cable, tryed 4 cables, STILL growing
2- I cleaned de PCB with an HIGHCUALITY Electronic Cleaner STILL growing
3- Tryed the 4Cables on all 6 SATA ports STILL growing
4- I removed the FANs STILL growing

This DO NOT HAPPEN with a Toshiba 750GB HDD
the HDD SMART Hardware ECC recovered and Seek error rate stays the same (Not grow)

What can I do? it is an HDD Problem? why it happen?

Thanks


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 Post subject: Re: -Hardw ECC recovered- and -Seek error rate- growingFAST
PostPosted: May 24th, 2017, 12:09 
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It's normal.
Nothing wrong with it.
Also your drive is a 7200.10. Those are the best Seagate drives that you can possible have. It's ST-10 back from the time when Seagate did build decent drives.
As long as you don't have re-located sectors you are good to go.
Those Hardware ECC corrected errors are normal on modern drives.

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 Post subject: Re: -Hardw ECC recovered- and -Seek error rate- growingFAST
PostPosted: May 24th, 2017, 13:42 
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Joined: September 8th, 2009, 18:21
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Seagate's Seek Error Rate, Raw Read Error Rate, and Hardware ECC Recovered SMART attributes:
http://www.users.on.net/~fzabkar/HDD/Seagate_SER_RRER_HEC.html

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 Post subject: Re: -Hardw ECC recovered- and -Seek error rate- growingFAST
PostPosted: May 25th, 2017, 13:05 
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fzabkar wrote:
Seagate's Seek Error Rate, Raw Read Error Rate, and Hardware ECC Recovered SMART attributes:
http://www.users.on.net/~fzabkar/HDD/Seagate_SER_RRER_HEC.html


Hi,
Very Good Work There Frank ,It Was Good To Read The Text You Wrote ,Thank You

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 Post subject: Re: -Hardw ECC recovered- and -Seek error rate- growingFAST
PostPosted: May 25th, 2017, 13:55 
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Spildit wrote:
It's normal.
Nothing wrong with it.
Also your drive is a 7200.10. Those are the best Seagate drives that you can possible have. It's ST-10 back from the time when Seagate did build decent drives.
As long as you don't have re-located sectors you are good to go.
Those Hardware ECC corrected errors are normal on modern drives.



Hello bro, nice to see you
Ok, i believe you, you are the boss,

I don't think you have get the big picture about what's happening with this drive.... when i say growing i don't mean 20 or 40, i mean 50000
Example:
Yesterday 11:53am -5CUBA, when i post this it had
-Seek error rate-----------------58721051 and growing
-Hardware ECC recovered-------206385178 and growing

This is TODAY 24h later
-Seek error rate-----------------62308546 and growing
-Hardware ECC recovered--------12697100 and growing :shock: WTF!

This PC just worked like 6h yesterday, on the Seek error rate whe have a diference of 3587495 on Hardware ECC recovered i don't know WTF happened!! maybe i wrote it wrong(i don't think so)

Right now i have a SO (WinXP) working on this HDD, right now i'm looking the HDTune Smart data it grows per Seconds

nice reading fzabkar BUT my knowledge on Digital sistems says when a kind of event like this happens, Speed could be afected, because most of the data proceced have to be ECC corrected, this doasen't happen on all modern drives, i have seen Seagate ST1000DM003 with this att on ZERO, and anothers with this att not on Zero but it don't grow. But mi question is simple, why is this happening? heads? bad surface?


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 Post subject: Re: -Hardw ECC recovered- and -Seek error rate- growingFAST
PostPosted: May 25th, 2017, 16:14 
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@titokhonan, you didn't understand my article.

A raw Seek Error Rate value of 58721051 means that your drive has performed 58721051 seeks without a single error. The normalised value of this attribute would be 77 or 78.

    (-10) log10(1 / 58721051) = 77.7

The raw Hardware ECC Recovered value reflects the number of reads during the current measurement interval. When this number hits ~250 million, it rolls over to 0 and starts counting up again. The normalised value of this attribute reflects the number of errors recorded during this interval of 250 million reads.

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 Post subject: Re: -Hardw ECC recovered- and -Seek error rate- growingFAST
PostPosted: May 25th, 2017, 18:13 
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Meaning your 7200.10 drive is in a WAY BETTER SHAPE then your DM one ... Believe me .... You can keep on using that 7200.10 and i'm almost certain that it will last way longer than your DM one even if you keep the DM one stored on a shelf....

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 Post subject: Re: -Hardw ECC recovered- and -Seek error rate- growingFAST
PostPosted: May 25th, 2017, 18:18 
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titokhonan wrote:
(...) i have seen Seagate ST1000DM003 with this att on ZERO, and anothers with this att not on Zero but it don't grow.


Yeah ... and all of us can tell you that they will die and will take all of your data with them no matter what. The probability for that to happen to a 7200.10 is way lower. Let's say that 30% of DM drives will die against 1% of 7200.10 drives over a short period of time ....

:D :D :D

7200.10 is ST-10 "old" barracuda style.
DM is F3 ARCH "junk".

Don't even bother to compaere the 2. I have one of those 7200.10 running since 2008 on my main system without a single bad sector or re-located sector. I doubth that ANY DM will last more than 2 or 3 years without some sort of "problems" .... not to mention that the quality of the platter surface and heads are plain junk and the firmware is even worse ....

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 Post subject: Re: -Hardw ECC recovered- and -Seek error rate- growingFAST
PostPosted: May 26th, 2017, 17:09 
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Spildit wrote:
Let's say that 30% of DM drives will die against 1% of 7200.10 drives over a short period of time


Image
OMG


lol i knew that, on my job almost all the hdd are ST1000DM003, that the SHITTIEST hard drive i have ever seen!!! it's amazing how Seagate have a High level of sales with their shitties drives, and WD is below them on sales.

Do you have a list of Seagate and another Sellers worldwide broken drives? it's something hard to find but.... you are the imposible-man, the dude who deal with imposible task :D


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 Post subject: Re: -Hardw ECC recovered- and -Seek error rate- growingFAST
PostPosted: May 26th, 2017, 17:56 
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Sorry i don't have any list of drives that you should avoid but i would say based on what i recieve for recovery and as damaged drives to play with that friends offer to me :

NEVER BUY/USE for DATA STORAGE (mechanincal standard HDDs only list) :

- ANYTHING that it's a SEAGATE F3 arch (7200.11 including those and up). Use 7200.10 and below instead.

- Toshiba 2.5 drives from MKxxxxGSYN and MKxxxxGSX series !!! "Modern" Toshiba laptop drives are "decent" but you should avoid those series AT ALL COSTS. Almost all Toshiba drives that i'm getting now for recovery are from those 2 series and they normaly have head/surface problems.

- Old MAXTOR. Ok, i shouldn't be saying this because no-one should be using those anymore but there are some realy bad MAXTORs out there like the N40P. This doesn't apply to Seagate ST-10 drives branded as "Maxtor".

- Avoid old IBM/Hitachi "Deskstars". Some old IDE models have huge problems with the surface of the platters and there are typical cases of glass platter getting all the substract turning intro dust. This is a "famouse" problem and those drives were called "DeathStars" some years ago. Modern HGST ARM based drives are very good. Most likely for 3.5 drives you should be buying one of those.

- WD is "decent" but avoid "green" drives. You don't want to have a WD Green drive no matter what. Not as bad as Seagate DM but ... they still suck.

I don't have any data about Fujitsu 2.5 laptop drives as i don't see that many so hopefully they are ok.

The majority of "broken" 2.5 drives that i'm getting from friends for parts and from people to recover are :

- Toshibas from the mentioned series.
- Seagates from F3 arch like momentus .6 and thin drives.
- Some WD drives with "slow" issue and some considerable amount of bad blocks. Those can be re-used with SS most of the time but i do have some with bad heads as well.
- Once in a while i see one Fujitsu from a random family but it's very rare.
- It's very rare to get Hitachi as well and most of the times i love to get hitachi because either they have bad PCB that can be replaced (drive doesn't spin at all) or the problem is with SA (normaly both copies of a module is damaged). IBM/Hitachi/HGST drives are very easy to re-use ad fix most of the time as the surface tends to be very reliable. Also there are the FORMAT UNIT command to move G to P and format user space so those drives are refurb friendly.

- Old Samsung 3.5 drives are JUNK. Drives like 80GB IDE SP0802N are JUNK and you want to stay away from them for good. Those tend to have surface degradation/heads problems. 500 GB and up both IDE and SATA normaly are pretty good. I do have a Samsung HD103SI 1TB running here for years now without a single bad block. Samsung drives from 500 GB and up are more or less reliable at least the 3.5 ones. As for 2.5 ones i do recieve some random models from time to time and the majority of cases are bad surface / heads. Those drives normaly don't have MC damage with exception of A-List problems that it's more or less easy to fix but relates to bad sectors in any case. Also some modern series have famouse firmware problems as the FIPS module on ROM getting damaged and some drives have PUIS issues that once is turned on it cn't be turned off and the ROM gets messed up (checksums). I would say that hopefully newer models will not suffer from those problems but i might be wrong. In any case if i have to chose i think i would go for either 3.5 Hitachi or 2.5 Toshiba (modern models only). Again for Toshiba check that you don't have an "older" 2.5 one or you will get intro problems later.

- And of course don't use Quantum or older stuff like some WDC MCU based drives with famouse "translator" problem, etc ...

Hope this helps.

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 Post subject: Re: -Hardw ECC recovered- and -Seek error rate- growingFAST
PostPosted: May 27th, 2017, 13:06 
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Spildit wrote:
Sorry i don't have any list of drives that you should avoid but i would say based on what i recieve for recovery and as damaged drives to play with that friends offer to me.......

........And of course don't use Quantum or older stuff like some WDC MCU based drives with famouse "translator" problem, etc ...

Hope this helps.


I have to make a post about this.


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