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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 28th, 2017, 9:39 
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Joined: March 9th, 2017, 6:16
Posts: 61
Location: trinidad
Jared
You have loaded guns too early . I have nothing to do with softwares mentioned in thread . By looking at the thread its clear I am not sales representative of any software. like You I own a DR company. I am wondering how you conclude so much early. A DR pro. needs patience . Ha Ha Ha.
Maximus is right & he knows my point . Pls. note I have mentioned 3 softwares just to prove my point that vendors make tall claim.I have also mentioned logicube forensic falcon has claimed cloning speed of 30GB/S. Now do you think I am sales guy of both competitor products at the same time?
Who will keep such person on job who advertise competition. Hope point is clear to you.
About the software. Developer has not openly advertised and is not willing to sell it internationally reasons best known to them only.
Software is claimed to use proprietary algoritham and some of the features like Skip /Jump sectors , Retry no. of times ( no free software has this features). It supports USB and Raid. Pls.correct me if I am wrong.
A commercial paid software is always good as developer can make continuous development and give active support. Free softwares may have bugs and no technical support.
Reason I have not mentioned name of the software is I have not personally tested it , only when I am confidendant , I can say something about the product.
I have sent PM to all who were interested.
If by chance I got it , then I will make full review by doing extensive testing.
Thank you all.


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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 28th, 2017, 10:16 
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Joined: November 7th, 2015, 13:04
Posts: 100
Location: Austin metro area TX USA
bunty, I might have missed it, have you settled on one or two cloning tools that will work flawlessly on the equipment you have?

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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 28th, 2017, 12:27 
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Joined: October 16th, 2013, 13:21
Posts: 171
Location: Brazil
bunty wrote:
Software is claimed to use proprietary algoritham and some of the features like Skip /Jump sectors , Retry no. of times ( no free software has this features). It supports USB and Raid. Pls.correct me if I am wrong.


Hmmm.... an utility from an esteemed member of this forum also has these features ( and is free software ) . I´ve used it with many disks, and it has worked ok. Would suggest some minor cosmetic changes, but that is just personal preference.

bunty wrote:
Reason I have not mentioned name of the software is I have not personally tested it , only when I am confidendant , I can say something about the product.
I have sent PM to all who were interested.


Maybe you should mention its name, someone from the forum may have experience with it and could say something about it.
If you do not desire to write it here, could you tell me via PM also the name ? Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 28th, 2017, 12:34 
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Joined: August 15th, 2006, 3:01
Posts: 2283
Location: CDRLabs @ Chandigarh [ India ]
bunty wrote:
Jared
You have loaded guns too early . I have nothing to do with softwares mentioned in thread . By looking at the thread its clear I am not sales representative of any software. like You I own a DR company. I am wondering how you conclude so much early. A DR pro. needs patience . Ha Ha Ha.
Maximus is right & he knows my point . Pls. note I have mentioned 3 softwares just to prove my point that vendors make tall claim.I have also mentioned logicube forensic falcon has claimed cloning speed of 30GB/S. Now do you think I am sales guy of both competitor products at the same time?
Who will keep such person on job who advertise competition. Hope point is clear to you.
About the software. Developer has not openly advertised and is not willing to sell it internationally reasons best known to them only.
Software is claimed to use proprietary algoritham and some of the features like Skip /Jump sectors , Retry no. of times ( no free software has this features). It supports USB and Raid. Pls.correct me if I am wrong.
A commercial paid software is always good as developer can make continuous development and give active support. Free softwares may have bugs and no technical support.
Reason I have not mentioned name of the software is I have not personally tested it , only when I am confidendant , I can say something about the product.
I have sent PM to all who were interested.
If by chance I got it , then I will make full review by doing extensive testing.
Thank you all.


+ 1 ,
I also suggest jared to not jump to conclusions so fast ,i have also experienced this when he sent me a warning on data medic forums without even checking my posting history ,For a while i stopped posting there due to this but gave in ultimately

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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 28th, 2017, 13:25 
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Joined: December 19th, 2006, 8:49
Posts: 7797
Location: Portugal
HaQue wrote:
IMHO this tool isnt going to help with the Flash job you described.


Agree !!!

Neither the tool that was mentioned by PM ...

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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 28th, 2017, 18:23 
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Joined: December 4th, 2012, 1:35
Posts: 2882
Location: Adelaide, Australia
we all get obsessed in finding a certain software, or buying some hardware kit. Once aquired it rarely lives up to expectations and is rarely worth the time spent. Most often we think it is going to save us from work and be a simple click solution. There is no replacement for actual work and learning, and generally the tool plays a less significant role.
Unless you are talking about software/hardware/people combo like VNR compared to competitor, or PC3K for hard drives. notable exceptions


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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 28th, 2017, 23:12 
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Joined: January 29th, 2012, 1:43
Posts: 283
Location: United States
bunty wrote:
A commercial paid software is always good as developer can make continuous development and give active support. Free softwares may have bugs and no technical support.

I can argue that for both sides.

Case 1: gnuddrescue
The author (Antonio Diaz Diaz) is active on the project. People send requests for features and report bugs, and those requests and issues are addressed in a fairly timely manner. Plus the software is open source, so others can actually make modifications of their own if necessary. I personally had a direct influence on improvements to the algorithm between versions 1.17 and 1.19. While Antonio and I don't always agree, he took my suggestions and made improvements beyond what I was suggesting, making ddrescue a very robust tool (as long as you know how to use the settings). If anything were to happen to Antonio, the software can still continue to live and be improved by others since it is open source.

Case 2: hddsuperclone (my software)
As you may guess, I am very much active on the project. I answer to both bug reports and feature requests in a timely manner, which helps keep the software up to date. While the current version is free, I intend there to be a paid version, so it is not open source. So this could be considered commercial software in that respect. But if something happens to me, the software developement would be dead, unless I somehow leave provisions for it to be sold or openly released.

Case 3: Commercial software (this is a generic example, no specific software, unless you want to include Microsoft in this group)
I have seen many occasions where commercial software from large companies has bugs that go unresolved for months if not years. Feature requests go unanswered unless a very large group of people request them. The level of technical support can vary. There may be phone support (which you will not get with the likes of ddrescue or hddsuperclone), but phone support often only helps for the simple common issues, and any true technical issues are hard to get answers for. You will almost never talk directly to a developer.

Case 4: Commercial software from a small company (again, no specific software)
This is a best case scenario. A small company is formed that produces a specialize software. It offers good support and responds promptly to bug reports and feature requests. When you have a technical issue that is beyond the initial tier 1 support, you may actually end up talking to a developer that can understand your issue. This is what you wish from any company that supplies software.

Case 5: Open source freeware that is buggy and poorly supported (again, no specific software)
Someone writes software, possibly for themselves, makes it public and open source, and then really doesn't care much about it, or doesn't have the time to continue work on it. Support is limited or does not exist.

Case 6: Paid software from an individual that is buggy and poorly supported (again, no specific software)
Someone writes software, thinks it is good enough to sell, and then really doesn't care much about it, or doesn't have the time to continue work on it. Support is limited or does not exist. The software will die with the author, if is isn't already dead from lack of support.

I am sure there are other levels of examples. But my point is that freeware (open source or not) is not always buggy, underdeveloped, and unsupported. And commercial software is not always well supported and without bugs.


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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 28th, 2017, 23:26 
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Joined: January 29th, 2012, 1:43
Posts: 283
Location: United States
bunty wrote:
Software is claimed to use proprietary algoritham and some of the features like Skip /Jump sectors , Retry no. of times ( no free software has this features). It supports USB and Raid. Pls.correct me if I am wrong.
Thank you all.

Well, technically, hddsuperclone has a proprietary algorithm, I call it a "self learning head skipping algorithm". No one else has it, it is my own creation. Skipping / Jumping sectors is done by both ddrescue and hddsuperclone with algorithm, along with control of retries. So the statement that no free software has this is untrue. Both work on USB drives. As for RAID, I believe that statement comes from the fact that Linux itself supports RAID, not the software (I am basing that on the information available about the software). If that is correct, then both ddrescue and hddsuperclone could both claim to support RAID.

I am not trying to put down the software, I am just trying to point out some basic facts.


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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 29th, 2017, 0:14 
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Joined: December 4th, 2012, 1:35
Posts: 2882
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Personally I think if you need a cloning tool that does more than HDDsuperClone, then you aren't now looking for a cloning tool.


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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 29th, 2017, 1:03 
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Joined: January 29th, 2012, 1:43
Posts: 283
Location: United States
bunty wrote:
Reason I have not mentioned name of the software is I have not personally tested it , only when I am confidendant , I can say something about the product.
I have sent PM to all who were interested.
If by chance I got it , then I will make full review by doing extensive testing.

If you do get it, you should do comparison testing against hddsuperclone. And don't worry, the beta GUI version of hddsuperclone is very close to being released (maybe tomorrow, assuming that I don't find any major issues). You only have to start it with a terminal command, after that it is mostly mouse clicks (you do have to type a file name for saving). You will also be able to test my method of multilingual support to see how well it works.


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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 29th, 2017, 1:29 
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Joined: March 9th, 2017, 6:16
Posts: 61
Location: trinidad
Thank you all contributors .

hddsuperclone is getting matured everyday due to awesome work of maximus . Being generous he has still kept it free.
I am looking forward to test beta version for running case. Like Haque has pointed out there are 2 sides to a coin -- paid softwares are not always bug free and free softwares are not always bugged .
I will report results of this case .
Thank you.


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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 29th, 2017, 14:08 
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Joined: December 19th, 2006, 8:49
Posts: 7797
Location: Portugal
bunty wrote:
Thank you all contributors .

hddsuperclone is getting matured everyday due to awesome work of maximus . Being generous he has still kept it free.
I am looking forward to test beta version for running case. Like Haque has pointed out there are 2 sides to a coin -- paid softwares are not always bug free and free softwares are not always bugged .
I will report results of this case .
Thank you.


OpenBSD - One of the most secure OS ever made. Free. Open Source.

Salvation Data tools - $500 piece of junk (each HDD Doctor that will work on a brand of drives only) that will not work properly on the majority of cases and it's full of bugs that were not corrected/fixed over the years.

MRT Pro - Lot's of Bugs that are reported and were never fixed .... For years now. A $3000 tool.

Also on the place where i work there are some machines that costed $$$ (small fortune) and the Hospital pays $$$ (another small fortune) for tech support (each year). Software of those "machines" that costed thousands of Euros didn't get any bug fix and was not updated in ... 8-10 years. The "security" of those machines (that store inside them medication including psychotropic drugs) is one factor authentication with a 3 character password. You are not allowed to change the password and you are not allowed to set a password bigger than 3 characters/numbers. Also you don't log in with ID/Password. Just one factor - meaning you input just the password. There are 90 users that are registered there so .... lot's of "password". Things like "000" and "123" are valid passwords. Log-In for server machine is "admin" "admin" and passwords are "encrypted" on a SQL table by adding the value + 1 to the real password .... Again this costs thousands of $$$ and the software is so crappy that if you imput special characters that you use on Portugal language like "ç" or "á" the software will just display junk on the place of the character (one character is replaced by many) and people complain for years and this is not fixed and the hospital keeps paying those guys a fortune for tech support ...

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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 29th, 2017, 21:31 
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Joined: March 9th, 2017, 6:16
Posts: 61
Location: trinidad
I am keen to know what is the difference between ----

1) Connecting flash media to a PC USB port and using DE
2) Connecting Flash media through PC-USB PWR adapter and using DE.

Since this adapter is a passive type ( no active electronics is present) , how it works . I don't have this adapter yet .
Anyone who has used it can pls.share there experience with few snaps.
Thank you.


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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 30th, 2017, 13:19 
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Joined: December 19th, 2006, 8:49
Posts: 7797
Location: Portugal
bunty wrote:
I am keen to know what is the difference between ----

1) Connecting flash media to a PC USB port and using DE
2) Connecting Flash media through PC-USB PWR adapter and using DE.

Since this adapter is a passive type ( no active electronics is present) , how it works . I don't have this adapter yet .
Anyone who has used it can pls.share there experience with few snaps.
Thank you.


http://www.acelaboratory.com/news/newsi ... itemid=191

The new adapter has been developed to turn on/off the power supply of an individual USB device, connectable to standard PC ports. It enables the PC-3000 to work with:

External storage drives
USB Flash drives
Card readers
Other USB devices
The adapter is especially useful in cases when a device allows access to data, but freezes or requires resetting to continue working correctly. The adapter automates the resetting process and enables the engineer to control it via the Data Extractor, without the need to manually plug the cable.

USB 1.0, USB 1.1, USB 2.0, USB 3.0 devices are supported.

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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 30th, 2017, 17:27 
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Joined: September 8th, 2009, 18:21
Posts: 9518
Location: Australia
ISTM that the adapter derives its power from the +5V rail of a SATA power connector instead of the +5V pin of the host's USB port. This enables PC3000 to control power to the USB device via its SATA power control electronics.

Code:
+5V o---o _/o---o o------.
         /               |
          |    SATA      |
          |    +5V       |
PC3K      |              |
power ----'         SATA |
control            .-----|----.    .----------.
                   |     '----|----|          |
    o--------------|----------|----|   USB    |
Data +/-           | adapter  |    |  device  |
    o--------------|----------|----|          |
              USB  |    .-----|----|          |
              host '----|-----'    '----------'
                        |
    .-------------------'
    |
    |
   ===
   GND

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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 30th, 2017, 19:38 
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Joined: January 29th, 2012, 1:43
Posts: 283
Location: United States
@bunty, the GUI version of HDDSuperClone has been released. You can try it on that memory card if you like. But I am doubtful that it will help as much as you would like.

Also, in my testing, I found that I have a computer that has a memory card reader installed (built in), but it does not respond correctly to the commands of hddsuperclone. In my defense, it is an Emachine, which is a very cheap brand of computer, and I have already had issues with the IDE mode in BIOS not working properly.


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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 31st, 2017, 0:26 
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Joined: March 9th, 2017, 6:16
Posts: 61
Location: trinidad
Good Morning Team.
Thank you so much fzabkar & Spildit for detailed explanation.

maximus has put great efforts in developing gui version which will be definitely helpful for guys like me who are not familiar with terminal level work.
I will give it a try & update my results.


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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 31st, 2017, 12:26 
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Joined: March 9th, 2017, 6:16
Posts: 61
Location: trinidad
Congratulations maximus for developing best cloning tool. I tried gui version on CF card today. I have selected reverse clone . Almost 99.16% cloning was successful . Unfortunately cloned disk does not show any data (though it shows NTFS file system )
As per customer card is not getting recognized suddenly & he has not done anything.
I am fearful as maximus has said , it could be be issue with commands not working on flash media.
My concern for putting this thread was because of this reason only. HDDSUPERCLONE is the best option for hard disk cloning. I have decided to clone 10 differnent types of hard disks ( SAS/SATA /IDE ) and test hddsuperclone extensively on DCO /HPA , and to verify SHA1 of both source and target. This is only to help maximus , my small contribution for his great work.
I think its clear now why I was looking for a commercial cloning tool for flash media. Meantime I have got response from tool developer ,he has quoted exorbitantly high price so I have closed that subject.( I can buy 2 deepspar units in quoted price) . Besides no evaluation is possible.
Now I have 2 options --
1) Customer or person who might have done R&D before me ,might have accidentally formatted card in camera in order to recover data.
(often several cases I get are formatted by DIY customers as well as DR technicians in order to gain access to inaccessible media)
2) Try some other tool /technique -- pls.suggest.


Attachments:
File comment: Target file system
target.jpg
target.jpg [ 148.33 KiB | Viewed 658 times ]
File comment: HDDSUPERCLONE in action
P_20170531_195514.jpg
P_20170531_195514.jpg [ 1.56 MiB | Viewed 658 times ]
File comment: HDDSUPERCLONE in action
P_20170531_182044.jpg
P_20170531_182044.jpg [ 1.27 MiB | Viewed 658 times ]
File comment: HDDSUPERCLONE in action
P_20170531_181957.jpg
P_20170531_181957.jpg [ 1.18 MiB | Viewed 658 times ]
File comment: hex view cloned ssd
3.PNG
3.PNG [ 62.78 KiB | Viewed 658 times ]
File comment: hex view cloned ssd
2.PNG
2.PNG [ 62.62 KiB | Viewed 658 times ]
File comment: Hex view cloned ssd
1.PNG
1.PNG [ 44.96 KiB | Viewed 658 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 31st, 2017, 14:48 
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Joined: September 8th, 2009, 18:21
Posts: 9518
Location: Australia
Why does the target drive have a 120GB NTFS partition? If the card was formatted in a camera, then it should have a 64GB partition, most probably FAT32 or exFAT. I'm guessing that someone "initialised" the card in a Windows machine.

I would examine the clone with a disc editor, eg DMDE. Can you show us DMDE's Partitions window?

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 Post subject: Re: Cloning Tool
PostPosted: May 31st, 2017, 19:04 
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Joined: January 29th, 2012, 1:43
Posts: 283
Location: United States
bunty wrote:
I think its clear now why I was looking for a commercial cloning tool for flash media. Meantime I have got response from tool developer ,he has quoted exorbitantly high price so I have closed that subject.( I can buy 2 deepspar units in quoted price) . Besides no evaluation is possible.

If the developer quoted that high of a price for a software only tool that can't really do any more than an available freeware tool, then it is a total scam. Another sign of that is that you had trouble getting a response from the developer. I have respected the fact that you did not wish to name the software tool, but if what you just said it true, you should respect that it should be publicly named to the hall of shame. I won't do it, but please consider that even though you think that is must be good because no one in your country would do such a thing, it sure seems like you are wrong.


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