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 Post subject: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: October 28th, 2018, 22:42 
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Joined: October 28th, 2018, 22:35
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I have an broke wd10tmvw-11zsms5 which one is out from a wd my passport.

it was dropped to surface when it was working 5 years ago. there was'nt anything important inside the disk.

Well, i've tried to recover it. i don't have a donor disk, yet. but i take out the head and some magnets. and i take out the platter on the top and put it back. but now it's turned some degrees of clockwise. I didn't touch it.

1) is that important the platter on the top won't be exact position?

2) i pulled out the head w/o using head comb, does that damaged the platters?

i will buy this head comb : https://www.ebay.com/itm/401242337379

and will buy a second hand the exact disk.

should i change the platters to the other disk or take donor disk's head to the broken one? which one is better?
this is only a experimental process. i just wanna know despite all theese thoughtless things i've done, will i still be able to recover my old data. i really wanna know what was inside of that disk.

so is it important the positions of each platter?
platter swap or head swap?

thanks and sorry for my language, i'm still learning


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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: October 29th, 2018, 1:08 
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any modarator please move this topic to this forum plese : https://forum.hddguru.com/viewforum.php?f=1 a


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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: October 29th, 2018, 3:11 
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The positions of the plates in are important respecting the position and the face, that is to say you can not turn over a plate or the one on the bottom to put it on, but if you can move them an angle between them.

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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: October 29th, 2018, 19:06 
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mhp666 wrote:
The positions of the plates in are important respecting the position and the face, that is to say you can not turn over a plate or the one on the bottom to put it on, but if you can move them an angle between them.



So, did i lose my chance to recover my data? is it over :roll:


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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: October 29th, 2018, 21:06 
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Joined: November 22nd, 2017, 21:47
Posts: 166
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Quote:
Well, i've tried to recover it. i don't have a donor disk, yet. but i take out the head and some magnets. and i take out the platter on the top and put it back. but now it's turned some degrees of clockwise. I didn't touch it.

But you opened it in a regular (= dusty) environment, which is enough to make things worse.

Quote:
1) is that important the platter on the top won't be exact position?

Yes, for drives with multiple platters it is crucial that the factory alignment be maintained VERY precisely ; once that alignment is lost, it is extremely difficult if not impossible to restore access to the data. From what I could gather, even data recovery labs can't do that (restore the original alignment) ; perhaps the manufacturer could but as far as I know they don't provide that kind of service.

Quote:
2) i pulled out the head w/o using head comb, does that damaged the platters?

Possibly, possibly not, but now that's the least of your worries. The heads can be replaced, the platters can not.

Quote:
should i change the platters to the other disk or take donor disk's head to the broken one? which one is better?

Data recovery experts almost never touch the platters, only when the drive suffered severe damage, caused by shock, fire, drowning, wrath of God, angry ex girlfriend with a sledgehammer, and the like. In such cases, special tools are used to move all the platters at the same time so as to preserve their relative alignment, and even with the right tools it seems to be a very tricky process.
That's how it's done :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JOIpLRNu7wg
(But : 1) he should be wearing gloves, and perhaps wax his furry forearms ; 2) the defective drive has a prominent scratch so, if this is an actual recovery and not just a quick demonstration, the chances for a successful recovery are probably low ; 3) I'm wondering what is that dark pointy thing that sticks out of his left fist...)

Quote:
So, did i lose my chance to recover my data? is it over :roll:

Short of a true miracle, I would say yes.


Quote:
The positions of the plates in are important respecting the position and the face, that is to say you can not turn over a plate or the one on the bottom to put it on, but if you can move them an angle between them.

I did not understand this sentence... :?


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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: October 31st, 2018, 3:21 
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Joined: October 28th, 2018, 22:35
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abolibibelot wrote:
Quote:
Short of a true miracle, I would say yes.



What is the tolerance for that? it's just 1-2 degrees of movement. I may try to get it to the old exact point.

Don't the other 3 platters keep the same data? Can't any software help me with that disk?

I'm really upset about that, i was just acted very impatient. :(


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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: October 31st, 2018, 11:39 
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Joined: August 26th, 2012, 19:18
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Hi Murat,
Without a thorough check, we can only guess the damage and/or chances of recovery.

A professionally equipped lab might offer a more rigorous diagnosis, or possible repair/recovery, for a fee.

For your own effort/attempt you say there is nothing of value on there and you appear to have very limited resources and experience.
Going further would probably be a significant waste of both your time and money.

In simple terms given your explanation and, with no disrespect, this is like crashing your ship into an iceberg and asking if re arranging the deckchairs will help.

You have performed so many actions that contributed to it's current condition that picking just one symptom, to treat now, is practically immaterial.
For instance if you rotated a single platter only, with respect to the others, you are lost already.

maybe have a read here : https://tierradatarecovery.co.uk/my-har ... -recovery/
for general info.

sorry.

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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: October 31st, 2018, 14:43 
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At one point I disagree, alignment of platters is not a problem in a Helios drive :wink:

But you will not have a chance on your own - sorry.
Good that there was nothing important on the drive.

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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: October 31st, 2018, 15:00 
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digisupport wrote:
At one point I disagree, alignment of platters is not a problem in a Helios drive :wink:

But you will not have a chance on your own - sorry.
Good that there was nothing important on the drive.


Couldn’t agree more, alignment isn’t an issue on these drives.

But DIY time is over, and possibly this drive should RIP :-(

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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: October 31st, 2018, 21:43 
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Joined: October 28th, 2018, 22:35
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digisupport wrote:
At one point I disagree, alignment of platters is not a problem in a Helios drive :wink:

But you will not have a chance on your own - sorry.
Good that there was nothing important on the drive.



Wait wait wait. if the alligment is not important. Could i still have a chance? it's a 4 platter disk. How those 4 platters keep the data?

data is not important inside of it. some family pictures and useless stuff. I just wanna save my data and feel like seeing an old friend after a long time. There was no dust in that environment.


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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: November 1st, 2018, 2:45 
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Joined: January 28th, 2009, 10:54
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Helios drives are 3 platter not 4.
Even though the above statements about alignment not being critical on these models is correct, the fact still stands; you have about zero chances for DIY. A very skilled engineer could maybe get something off this drive, assuming platters are ok.

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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: November 1st, 2018, 7:31 
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northwind wrote:
Helios drives are 3 platter not 4.
Even though the above statements about alignment not being critical on these models is correct, the fact still stands; you have about zero chances for DIY. A very skilled engineer could maybe get something off this drive, assuming platters are ok.


sorry, yes it's 3 platters.

so, which one should i do?

1) take an other head from a donor disk and place it to the my drive.

2) take platters with scotch tape and place them into the donor disk.

The original disk's magnets and other stuff is outside of the disk. so, it would be easier to move the platters. encourage me and give me hope. I need hope :)


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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: November 1st, 2018, 8:46 
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I'm wishing you the best of luck. However, as I've said,

northwind wrote:
you have about zero chances for DIY.

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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: November 1st, 2018, 15:44 
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northwind wrote:
I'm wishing you the best of luck. However, as I've said,

northwind wrote:
you have about zero chances for DIY.


Zero chance is optimistic IMHO, by destroying any chance of recovery the chances are less than zero.

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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: November 4th, 2018, 7:28 
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i stand corrected, thanks for the drive specific info.
I'll go biomass right now :)

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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: November 5th, 2018, 1:47 
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Joined: November 22nd, 2017, 21:47
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https://tierradatarecovery.co.uk/my-har ... -recovery/
Quote:
The donor drive must be similarly prepared as the platters will now be moved from the failed drive to the donor. This is an extra-ordinarily delicate procedure, not only must the platter surfaces never be touched but the relative rotational position of the platters must be maintained. The relative alignment of the platters within the drive is critical, should the platters rotate to even the smallest degree with respect to each other then all data would instantly be lost, files are written across the multiple platter surfaces (as opposed to filling one surface and then moving onto the next). In other words a file may be stored in part on the uppermost platter surface and in part on the one below.

Aren't there software means to recreate the correct alignment, when it's been lost through such clueless tinkering, by first performing a platter-by-platter image, and then either through trial-and-error, or by assembling bits and pieces of one file large enough to have parts on all platters, and which would happen to be backed-up, or which would still be available for download ? (For instance an ISO file, or a movie file... hopefully not fragmented !) And in a case like this, are the smaller files (pictures, documents...) still readable, or only the ones located on the first “stroke zone” of the first platter (if that makes sense), or nothing at all ? If RAID stripes can be re-created after a failure, what is preventing the recovery of a single drive with misaligned platters ?
(I'm just asking out of curiosity, not to give false hope to “murat4”... Even if there is such a possibility it must be damn expensive ! :? )


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 Post subject: Re: is it important the positions of each platters
PostPosted: November 7th, 2018, 16:40 
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Joined: October 3rd, 2005, 0:40
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Location: Hungary
Quote:
Even if there is such a possibility it must be damn expensive


yes, we (and probably other dr firms too) get a lot of DIY tampered drives. I feel sorry for their owners but i am past the point where i cared. They get their nice quote and some words on why the numbers are what they are.
We can solve a lot of things but wasn't it more simple to do it the right way?

pepe

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