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 Post subject: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 9th, 2017, 18:36 
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Location: USA
Hi
Can someone remind me of the technique for reading a chip that has to be turned. It has 4 parts, 2 read with the chip in one way, 2 read with the chip turned 180. As the case only sees the first 2 parts, how do we set up the configuration so VNR knows it has 4 parts that need to be read?
Thanks

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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 10th, 2017, 4:15 
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Hi,
This is The First Time i Am Hearing This ,Waiting For Our Seniors To Respond

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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 10th, 2017, 12:42 
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Hhhhmmm
viewtopic.php?f=27&t=35937

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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 10th, 2017, 15:56 
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Hm... If I'm understand you correctly you mean reading Chip which use 2 channels as for example in TLGA 52 etc where you got IO1-0...IO8-0 (for chennel 0) and then IO-1...IO-1 (for channel 1) ??

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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 10th, 2017, 16:04 
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I have used this technique before when I had difficulty reading a chip, but I needed VNR support to set it up and cannot remember how it was done. When I find out I will let you know.

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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 13th, 2017, 12:39 
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Apparently with some chips (this is a BGA 152 chip), a single chip needs to be set up as two chips in the case. Read the chip once once in the normal orientation with 2 parts, turned 180 in the reader and then read as a second chip with another 2 parts. PC3000 Flash sees this chip as having 4 parts without rotation by the way.

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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 13th, 2017, 13:31 
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ddrecovery wrote:
Apparently with some chips (this is a BGA 152 chip), a single chip needs to be set up as two chips in the case. Read the chip once once in the normal orientation with 2 parts, turned 180 in the reader and then read as a second chip with another 2 parts. PC3000 Flash sees this chip as having 4 parts without rotation by the way.


Hi,
Its Impossible to read by reversing as you said without modding the power reading scheme as otherwise all wrong reading schemes for reading the current chip will blow the brains out of this chip .So ideally the tool should be able to read without doing it .So If PC3K Flash is Reading It Correctly Its Awesome And This is How Its To Be Done .In My Case In My Recent Post i Had 4 Chips Each 4 Parts -> viewtopic.php?p=252433#p252433

PS : Pardon me if i am still unclear about something i should be knowing

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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 13th, 2017, 13:47 
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Amarbir[CDR-Labs] wrote:
Hi,
Its Impossible to read by reversing as you said without modding the power reading scheme as otherwise all wrong reading schemes for reading the current chip will blow the brains out of this chip .So ideally the tool should be able to read without doing it .So If PC3K Flash is Reading It Correctly Its Awesome And This is How Its To Be Done .In My Case In My Recent Post i Had 4 Chips Each 4 Parts -> viewtopic.php?p=252433#p252433

That is true with PC3K as its set up to just read the chip in one direction (pin 1 specific). If you did that with PC3K it would blow the chip. But the VNR reader is different. I do not know the technicalities of why it doesn't blow the chip, but I will post a video after I have finished reading it. I am sure someone from VNR can tell us why?

PC3K did not have the XOR for this case.

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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 13th, 2017, 13:59 
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Friends, you talk about BGA 132/152 chips. If you look on pinout you can see it have 2 parts - mirrored. So it is possible rotate 180 degree and it is ok without problem. But NEVER do with other chips. PC3K adapter have connection for both sides together so no need rotate. VNR probably have one side only so you must rotate to read both banks.

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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 13th, 2017, 13:59 
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Location: CDRLabs @ Chandigarh [ India ]
ddrecovery wrote:
Amarbir[CDR-Labs] wrote:
Hi,
Its Impossible to read by reversing as you said without modding the power reading scheme as otherwise all wrong reading schemes for reading the current chip will blow the brains out of this chip .So ideally the tool should be able to read without doing it .So If PC3K Flash is Reading It Correctly Its Awesome And This is How Its To Be Done .In My Case In My Recent Post i Had 4 Chips Each 4 Parts -> viewtopic.php?p=252433#p252433

That is true with PC3K as its set up to just read the chip in one direction (pin 1 specific). If you did that with PC3K it would blow the chip. But the VNR reader is different. I do not know the technicalities of why it doesn't blow the chip, but I will post a video after I have finished reading it. I am sure someone from VNR can tell us why?

PC3K did not have the XOR for this case.


Well,
I am now of the opinion i need another 2 tools also for my flash work .I did Save Money for VNR But Spent it On Something Else .I am now collecting funds again .So Might Be in Jan 2018 or Dec 2017 Christmas Time " If They Have a Deal Or Something " i might buy VNR or Flash Extractor "Not Decided " .Well i am sure PC3K can also read it if VNR Can Infact All NAND Reader Would Be .I am Waiting For The Video .Can You Post a Picture of This Chip And Tell us Whats Written Outside And Whats The ID Of This Chip ,Lets Get The Datasheet Out and dig into this a little more deeper

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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 13th, 2017, 14:01 
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arvika wrote:
Friends, you talk about BGA 132/152 chips. If you look on pinout you can see it have 2 parts - mirrored. So it is possible rotate 180 degree and it is ok without problem. But NEVER do with other chips. PC3K adapter have connection for both sides together so no need rotate. VNR probably have one side only so you must rotate to read both banks.


Well,
Here you Go Thanks Arvika .Could Not Be a Better Explanation .Still i am interested in finding more details and Id of this chip

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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 13th, 2017, 17:07 
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Datasheets FTW


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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 13th, 2017, 19:44 
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Thanks to "rotation" ability we can read 8 crystals from this chip without any tweaks/mods.
In this case you read it as 2 chips with 2 crystals (they don't share any common signals).

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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 15th, 2017, 12:02 
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Sasha Sheremetov wrote:
Thanks to "rotation" ability we can read 8 crystals from this chip without any tweaks/mods.
In this case you read it as 2 chips with 2 crystals (they don't share any common signals).


Well,
8 bloody crystals damn ,Just imagine if we have a chipoff of such a chip with 4 physical chips and the chip is not researched ,32 initials combinations haaa haaaa

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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 15th, 2017, 16:44 
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Normally data synchronously allocated across the chips.
Having bitmap data patterns, SA patterns and FS metadata it is a work for 10-30 min to figure out order of 4x8 dumps.

Speaking of combinations:
min = 4! = 24
max = 32! = 2,63x10^35

We had a flight recorder's SSD with 16x4 = 64 dumps, 5 controllers on board and asynchronous page allocation.
Took 2 days (2x7 hours) to rebuild.

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 Post subject: Re: Turning Chips
PostPosted: November 16th, 2017, 11:08 
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Location: CDRLabs @ Chandigarh [ India ]
Sasha Sheremetov wrote:
Normally data synchronously allocated across the chips.
Having bitmap data patterns, SA patterns and FS metadata it is a work for 10-30 min to figure out order of 4x8 dumps.

Speaking of combinations:
min = 4! = 24
max = 32! = 2,63x10^35

We had a flight recorder's SSD with 16x4 = 64 dumps, 5 controllers on board and asynchronous page allocation.
Took 2 days (2x7 hours) to rebuild.



Well,
I am Excited As a Bee Sasha ,I will be Emailing Your Company Soon ,But i Wanted To Buy VNR After FE ,I Assume FE i Can Complete More Jobs Easily Initially

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