WD1600 EIDE - Burnt with 12AC power applied - SMART RESET?

[sglare]

Hello,

I'm newbie. I just burnt my spare 160gb applying 12v AC to external enclosure that it was sitting in.
Cheers to Creative labs at this point, for making 12vAC adapter for their sub woofer

I have spare twin drive, purchased at exact time, the bare the same date, model, but DCM is slightly different. first four digits are different.

I've taken off the PCB, and it is burnt. One chip has big hole in it.

I'm thinking of swapping the drives PCB from one to another, BUT:

1.How to erase/reset SMART data on the good PCB, to do fresh start with damaged drive. ( I know that it stores evolution of bad sectors, over life of drive)

2. How to check whether nothing inside of the enclosure(where platters are) was burnt?

3. Can the PCB from good drive can be damaged while applying to burnt drive?


Thank you for Your responses, or any light that you shed.


S.

[N.C.]

Hi,

If you have 2 really close and similar drive, in this model, you can try the simple pcb swap to get out the data without any writing to the drive, and than drop the drive away....
If the pcb swap not works, you should find a pro.
Why?

1, Because you need to transfer the ROM data to the another PCB
2, Because your preamp inside the HDA is damaged, and you can't fix this problem, additionally if you open the drive, the price will be doubled or tripled!

If you have a little luck, this should work with a simple pcb swap, but based on the 12V ~, i bet for preamp is dead allready.
The 12V ~ is really agressive for the circuit wich is designed for 5V DC, i think you have less than 5% for still good preamp.

If you want to learn, read this topic:
results-the-yourself-solutions-t11912.html

Janos

[N.C.]

oh, almost forget:
The SMART data is INSIDE the HDA, this is not on the PCB.

[BlackST]

At this point SMART is the last problem, like the computer in the car dashboard that, after crashing on a tree, says 'warning , you have open boot'

[sglare]

Thank You.

The FaQ page was very useful, indeed. Now I'm more scared than confident.
Especially very last sentence "This is a technical forum, not a DIY for alughing on each other's faults."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but does it mean "This is NOT a place for you".

And if its not where should I seek for knowledge then.
Appreciate your help.


BUT, if like to support me on my quest there are few question that just arisen:

1.Is there a way to sample from outside, the preamp, to check if it been hit? So I could save the good PCB and drive.

2.If the SMART data collects information about bad sectors, and its within enclosure, NOt on PCB, that means that swapping PCB will not write new bad sector data to good PCB?

Thank You Again.

S.

[N.C.]

Thank You.

The FaQ page was very useful, indeed. Now I'm more scared than confident.
Especially very last sentence "This is a technical forum, not a DIY for alughing on each other's faults."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but does it mean "This is NOT a place for you".

no no, this is for other "gurus", who like to see the user destroy our chances...

And if its not where should I seek for knowledge then.
Appreciate your help.


BUT, if like to support me on my quest there are few question that just arisen:

1.Is there a way to sample from outside, the preamp, to check if it been hit? So I could save the good PCB and drive.

2.If the SMART data collects information about bad sectors, and its within enclosure, NOt on PCB, that means that swapping PCB will not write new bad sector data to good PCB?

Thank You Again.

S.

for your case:
If you want to save the pcb too, use one 0.5A fuse for the 5V line and simple replace the pcb and try to get the data, and drop the drive away.
if the fuse is blown, the preamp is gone, sure.
If the fuse still good, but the drive don't want to init, only clicks, than only a pro can help you.

Janos

[BlackST]

Sometimes is better to say things as they are :

Correct me if I'm wrong, but does it mean "This is NOT a place for you".
It depends on your attitude. If only you go to Russian forums you'll know what is a "warming welcome"

And if its not where should I seek for knowledge then.
You want it for free ? Ask, but don't expect it and take it easy if you get a sound NO . I had to pay for everything in my life, or work hard to achieve it for example. And some info are either proprietary or can bite us right back so - I speak for me - I won't share.
More clear example : if you ask an easy way to attempt disabling HPA, it's OK : get MHDD and do it. If you ask where exactly is the displacement of a security module on a specific drive, most probably we have to think some time about telling you that. If you come here and ask, let's say "I want to know the translator formula for a Samsung SP2514N, share it!"... imagine.

1.Is there a way to sample from outside, the preamp, to check if it been hit? So I could save the good PCB and drive.
See previous point.


2.If the SMART data collects information about bad sectors, and its within enclosure, NOt on PCB, that means that swapping PCB will not write new bad sector data to good PCB?
You don't know how SMART works. Use GOOGLE/WIKIPEDIA and search S.M.A.R.T. (Self Monitoring Analysis and Reporting Technique).

Note : There are a lot of reputable members from this forum in UK. Use the "search members" function. They are all professionals and run DR business AFAIK so they can REALLY help you getting your data. Not for free obviously.

[sglare]

Thank you for elaborated response, looks like it took some of your time.

My attitue might little on the unpleasant side. I'm sorry. I just thought that the information is out there, somewhere... just need to ask the right question.

I'm member of CGI community, I've spent many hours responding on number of issues from pixels to renderfarms, and it did cross my mind that the knowledge that I'm sharing it is actually undermining my job (architectural technician/architect). I found that there is always tension between folks who know, who don't know, and think they know. If someone is not prepared mentally to mentor and share information on the forum he do not join such.

I don't know how many times you guys had crash with your question on to expertsexchange wall, where you have to pay, pay, pay.

But if you do fell so, get the right notion and charge, no body will fell offended in any way. You said it, exactly right, there was sweat and blood on the way to your mastery, let every one knows how it translates to currency. I do. My hourly rate gets higher as I know more.

This is my second drive crisis, first one was easy, and critical. My office data was on stake, and my job. I've paid online, software company on the phone, we managed to getdataback with everything MBR. I was dos formatting my usb hdd fat to ntfs, while I made mistake and formatted my office box. ups. command line can be misleading. I went home the same day, just little bit later. Great life changing experience.
Told my wife about it, she still thinks that I spent money and time in more profane way, or two maybe.

Month later, my friend had lost her drive in HP laptop, and I was there to help. Booted from CD and just repeated steps. Victory kisses are awesome.

Now, its different. It was last drive, almost empty one. I just some small projects tha I did in US. I will probably never use it but I got this felling in my bones that I have to fix it. I'm not planning to frantically seek for help, and I'm not planning to open this with hammer(or shredder, have u seen this?).

I understand your point and its valid. I do agree with you. Tell me what to do get prepared, how to collect my small points to get essential information from You.

I already had contacted guys in London, they seem to be very helpful and reasonable. 99pounds. No data no fee policy. They have tons of jobs from forensics I believe. That would be my last resort.

Thats enough for preamble.

1.Is there a way to sample from outside, the preamp, to check if it been hit? So I could save myself from potentially frying PCB.
I've seen some pictures on line advising checking current resistance, with ohm-meter. Will it be sufficient?

2.SMART - valid point. I dont now much about this technique, but I've read somewhere that it learns over the lifespan of drive, which sectors to be omitted. So if you swap drives, wrong sectors will be under the hood/head. How will I prevent it from learning on the "burnt" platters. Because I planning to put PCM back to good drive afterward.

3.Where is official repair guide from WD? Does it exist? HP has some manuals for servicing laptops online.

Thank You BlackT and N.C. for past and future answers!

Regards
S.

[BlackST]

1) Without proper tools (I mean digital VTVM with highest impedance) you can only check the "resistance" comparing with a known good drive. Note that the preamplifier is mixed ECL logic and with a common multimeter bought at Fry's or Radio Shack or similar you can likely fry preamp and good drive too (and then they were two)...
If you want to see the signal from the read channel, is >1 GHz bandwidth, you can easily see it.... with Agilent or LeCroy DDA : just dig in your pockets about 10'000 EUR for DDA + differential probe.

2) If the preamp is fried, a PCB swap is useful like a tit on a bull. And the SMART is the LATEST of your problems.

3) Forget it. If you want in-depth info, only WD techs can help and most probably you have to pry the info out from their neurons. There are no service manuals you can "emule" or buy from manual sellers. HDDs are truly mysterious objects. And even if you have some info, it would be necessary to have and MASTER diagnostic tools that are approx. in the 10'000 / 20'000 EUR range. BTW, if it was available, do you think we were here discussing ?

Don't know why you are planning to do it by yourself , when at this point it would be likely a 1000 £ range problem , approx.
Didn't see the drive, so maybe it would be easier or can be worse, who knows ?


P.S. I have an OFFICIAL UNIVERSAL HDD REPAIR BOOK and I can give it to you for free : one page, only one line. Here it is :

SEND TO A PRO. PERIOD.

[N.C.]

1.Is there a way to sample from outside, the preamp, to check if it been hit? So I could save myself from potentially frying PCB.
I've seen some pictures on line advising checking current resistance, with ohm-meter. Will it be sufficient?

2.SMART - valid point. I dont now much about this technique, but I've read somewhere that it learns over the lifespan of drive, which sectors to be omitted. So if you swap drives, wrong sectors will be under the hood/head. How will I prevent it from learning on the "burnt" platters. Because I planning to put PCM back to good drive afterward.

3.Where is official repair guide from WD? Does it exist? HP has some manuals for servicing laptops online.

Thank You BlackT and N.C. for past and future answers!

Regards
S.

1. you can't do a reasonable test without really expensive tool. The FUSE technique is good enough for you to protect the pcb, but not the data!
The bad/damaged preamp can destroy the data inside the drive.

2. the SMART is NOT in the PCB, this is stored INSIDE the HDA!

3. Read BlackSt's answer.

[sglare]

Thank you Gurus!

Well, now I think I know what to do. Start saving for repair cost.

To be honest, dont you think its little absurd not to have compahensive gudie on this matter. Its almost dusk of revolving platter era, and still a mystery component? I can see big oppurtunity for you guys outhere. A book. 19.99 at barns n noble, I would buy it. I think I know the title of if already.

GIVE it TO PRO
How not to try DIY on your HDD and why.
by Platter Guru

1.SMART - last thing, inside - got it.
2.Head preamp will burn data if its malfunctioning on read attempt, MBR ? for example or worse. - got it.
3.Just to show what have bee scorched, attaching photo of exact same model WD1600JB-00GVC0 with mushroom.
4.How much should i bargain for, what your expertise on that rescue mission. London based.


Thank You.

S.

Attachments

WD1600JB-00GVC0 PCM

boom.jpg (74.55 KiB) Viewed 6964 times

[pcimage]

I can do this. In Peterborough.

PM me if interested.

[N.C.]

Yes, pcimage can help you, ask him for diagnose and cost...

Janos