Recovering Data from USB drive - not initialized
December 30th, 2014, 12:14
Windows 7, Pro, 64-bit. I did something stupid. I have internal backups and EXTERNAL backups. Through a series of stupid human tricks, I managed to clobber the data on the internal backup.
Hooked up the external backup - a 1TB Samsung hdd. It didn't show up in Windows. Put it in an external USB carrier, and Windows 7 disk manager WANTS to initialize it.
In Windows 7, using DISKPART, I can SEE the drive online, when it's in the USB carrier, but nothing else appears to see it.
I built a new system using Windows 8.1, tried the same things there with the same results. Internally connected, the drive isn't visible to Windows disk manager.
When the drive is plugged directly into a SATA port, I can't see it at all in DISKPART, but Windows Disk Manager wants to initialize it.
The data on the drive is important, but not critical, and I'd like to find a tool, preferably a free one, that will let me get into this drive and retrieve a TB of data. After that, I'll take a sledge hammer to the thing and the problem won't occur again, but the sheer volume of product out there are confusing.
Is there a way to determine what the problem is? Bad MBR? Bad partition? Or does it not matter and I just need something to mount it and read the thing?
I've got spare drives I can copy the data to, or even clone it to if that's the best way, but I'm looking for recommendations on what is most likely to work.
thanks,
Hooked up the external backup - a 1TB Samsung hdd. It didn't show up in Windows. Put it in an external USB carrier, and Windows 7 disk manager WANTS to initialize it.
In Windows 7, using DISKPART, I can SEE the drive online, when it's in the USB carrier, but nothing else appears to see it.
I built a new system using Windows 8.1, tried the same things there with the same results. Internally connected, the drive isn't visible to Windows disk manager.
When the drive is plugged directly into a SATA port, I can't see it at all in DISKPART, but Windows Disk Manager wants to initialize it.
The data on the drive is important, but not critical, and I'd like to find a tool, preferably a free one, that will let me get into this drive and retrieve a TB of data. After that, I'll take a sledge hammer to the thing and the problem won't occur again, but the sheer volume of product out there are confusing.
Is there a way to determine what the problem is? Bad MBR? Bad partition? Or does it not matter and I just need something to mount it and read the thing?
I've got spare drives I can copy the data to, or even clone it to if that's the best way, but I'm looking for recommendations on what is most likely to work.
thanks,
Re: Recovering Data from USB drive - not initialized
December 30th, 2014, 14:06
Attach the drive with SATA port and run Linux Live CD, ubuntu, fedora etc. That might give access to your data.
Re: Recovering Data from USB drive - not initialized
December 30th, 2014, 14:31
When the drive is attached via USB, Windows may be detecting the USB-SATA bridge hardware rather than the drive behind the bridge.
When connected via SATA, what does a tool such as CrystalDiskInfo tell you about the drive? Could we see the SMART and Identify Device reports?
http://crystalmark.info/software/Crysta ... dex-e.html
Can you see sector 0 with a disc editor, eg DMDE (freeware)?
http://dmde.com
When connected via SATA, what does a tool such as CrystalDiskInfo tell you about the drive? Could we see the SMART and Identify Device reports?
http://crystalmark.info/software/Crysta ... dex-e.html
Can you see sector 0 with a disc editor, eg DMDE (freeware)?
http://dmde.com
Re: Recovering Data from USB drive - not initialized
December 30th, 2014, 18:48
CrystalDisk doesn't even see the disk. No SMART information. Windows Disk Management doesn't see it either when it's plugged into a SATA PORT...
Just for giggles, I even TRIED to initialize the thing, and I get a message that there was an "initialization error". Don't recall the exact wording, but it was VERY non-descriptive!
Near as I can tell, NOTHING sees it when it's plugged in. I tried several versions of different bits of software that were supposed to be able to "fix" an uninitialized disk, and none of THEM could see the disk either - whether plugged in directly OR in the USB carrier.
I suspect the next reply is going to be that this backup is totally screwed...
Just for giggles, I even TRIED to initialize the thing, and I get a message that there was an "initialization error". Don't recall the exact wording, but it was VERY non-descriptive!
Near as I can tell, NOTHING sees it when it's plugged in. I tried several versions of different bits of software that were supposed to be able to "fix" an uninitialized disk, and none of THEM could see the disk either - whether plugged in directly OR in the USB carrier.
I suspect the next reply is going to be that this backup is totally screwed...
Re: Recovering Data from USB drive - not initialized
December 30th, 2014, 19:06
when it's connected directly the BIOS sees it ?
Re: Recovering Data from USB drive - not initialized
December 31st, 2014, 16:16
Does the drive spin up? If so, can you obtain a serial terminal log from it?
Re: Recovering Data from USB drive - not initialized
December 31st, 2014, 18:09
fzabkar wrote:Does the drive spin up? If so, can you obtain a serial terminal log from it?
You must be in the business of selling terminal adapters or something. Even when you're giving advice to someone who is hopelessly over their head, you always go to the old trusty terminal readout question.
I don't think the original poster even mentioned what brand drive it was.
Re: Recovering Data from USB drive - not initialized
December 31st, 2014, 19:17
data-medics wrote:I don't think the original poster even mentioned what brand drive it was.
Then maybe you should read the question.
GracieAllen wrote:Hooked up the external backup - a 1TB Samsung hdd.
Re: Recovering Data from USB drive - not initialized
January 1st, 2015, 19:25
Wow, thanks for all the replies... It may be a lost cause, but not due to lack of effort to help! Lemme try and answer some of the questions.
First of all i would ask for the OP to plug the drive to a computer PSU and check if the drive spins at all. Then we start from there,
Yes, the drive spins up fine whether connected directly to a SATA port or through the USB carrier.
If the drive does spin then the next question is does it produce strange or abnomal clicking or sounds normal ?
No noises, no clicks, no vibrations, nothing abnormal.
If there are no strange clicking then the drive might have firmware issues like damaged A-List causing a LED error. On those cases the TTL might be of some assistence but the OP will need tools and experience to make the drive work again.
I most likely have the tools if they're not anything too esoteric, but no experience trying to repair a hard drive.
Does the drive stops after a short while after power up (if it starts to spin at all) ?
As near as I can tell, it'll spin indefinitely. I've had it sitting, connected for several hours at a time and it spins the whole time.
The anwser to my question might provide more clues about what is going on with the drive and if it's possible or not for you to solve it by yourself (not likely).
What you describe so far leads me to believe that the problem is not "logic" and there is some phisical issue with the drive, as stated. Either mechanical or firmaware.
Do you intend to spend any money at all to get the data recovered ?
NO. I'd like to retain the data but it's not critical and if I can't get it back I'll destroy the drive as I've done others in the past that have failed.
For firmware (on the platters) problems you will need (more or less expensive) tools and the adaptor. For ROM problems you will need either firmware tools or a eeprom programmer. Buying a new PCB will not work as swaping the ROM chip might be required, unless you are lucky. So even if the problem is with the PCB buying one on ebay might not be an option unless you exactly match the firmware version. Firmware on the ROM chip of the PCB must match overlays written on platter or it will not work.
The drive is a SAMSUNG HD103UJ, 1TB drive. If the controller/logic board is not particularly difficult to change, I DO have an identical drive sitting here that I can swap the PCB from... Hadn't considered that but this drive WAS working on 12/18 - when the last backup was made to it, so whatever I did (or it did or cosmic rays did) it happened in the last 10 days while sitting in the fireproof safe!
If you are looking for a cheap alternative done by someone that takes Darta Recovery as an hobby (and not a profession) - ME - then the fix for the ROM problem or the firmware problem would cost you, let's say $40 USD + shipping costs to and from Portugal. If a PCB is needed then the price for that must be added as well. If the problem is heads related i can't help you out and you are adviced to use the services of a professional as opening the drive in safety requires lots of experience and a clean room or laminar flow bench with class 100 filtering.
A TTL adaptor to further diagnose the problem as mention is this :
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=192
When connected to the drive on the following way it will provide further details on drive status :
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=116&t=189
Then with the use of tools like the following and with experience and knowledge the firmware problems can be fixed to regain access to the data.
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=195
Of course the MOST IMPORTANT part is to diagnose correctly the issue with the drive, so please reply to the question that i have made.
Using firmware tools or TTL will not mean a thing if the problem is with a toasted PCB or shorted TVS or bad heads, etc ....
ROM problem (damaged FIPS section) is very frequent on some models of Samsung drives. On November alone i've fix 4 of those including one for a user on the acelab forum.
Example of FIPS damage (when i had to deal with it for the first time):
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=643
Other frequent issue is when the drive develop bad sectors and those are added to the defect list overflowing the list in a way that the drive gets stuck with LED error.
Example :
Explanation on how to fix it :
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=116&t=197
Example on how it's fixed :
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=178
But again, it all depends on the exact problem of the drive and the symptoms the drive is showing. It's the main duty of people working on the data recovery field to pay close attention to those small details to do a correct assessment of what is wrong with the drive.
An extra question - when you power on the drive by connecting it directly to the PC Power suppy and SATA cable, does the drive show itself on BIOS with the correct (or not) model name ? Does it show at all ?
At this time, as near as I can tell, neither Windows 8.1 BIOS, nor windows 7 BIOS sees the drive.
I'll read through the information you posted above and see if there's something in there that can help. I may also try swapping the PCB and see if that works.
I'll report back if I have anything useful found.
First of all i would ask for the OP to plug the drive to a computer PSU and check if the drive spins at all. Then we start from there,
Yes, the drive spins up fine whether connected directly to a SATA port or through the USB carrier.
If the drive does spin then the next question is does it produce strange or abnomal clicking or sounds normal ?
No noises, no clicks, no vibrations, nothing abnormal.
If there are no strange clicking then the drive might have firmware issues like damaged A-List causing a LED error. On those cases the TTL might be of some assistence but the OP will need tools and experience to make the drive work again.
I most likely have the tools if they're not anything too esoteric, but no experience trying to repair a hard drive.
Does the drive stops after a short while after power up (if it starts to spin at all) ?
As near as I can tell, it'll spin indefinitely. I've had it sitting, connected for several hours at a time and it spins the whole time.
The anwser to my question might provide more clues about what is going on with the drive and if it's possible or not for you to solve it by yourself (not likely).
What you describe so far leads me to believe that the problem is not "logic" and there is some phisical issue with the drive, as stated. Either mechanical or firmaware.
Do you intend to spend any money at all to get the data recovered ?
NO. I'd like to retain the data but it's not critical and if I can't get it back I'll destroy the drive as I've done others in the past that have failed.
For firmware (on the platters) problems you will need (more or less expensive) tools and the adaptor. For ROM problems you will need either firmware tools or a eeprom programmer. Buying a new PCB will not work as swaping the ROM chip might be required, unless you are lucky. So even if the problem is with the PCB buying one on ebay might not be an option unless you exactly match the firmware version. Firmware on the ROM chip of the PCB must match overlays written on platter or it will not work.
The drive is a SAMSUNG HD103UJ, 1TB drive. If the controller/logic board is not particularly difficult to change, I DO have an identical drive sitting here that I can swap the PCB from... Hadn't considered that but this drive WAS working on 12/18 - when the last backup was made to it, so whatever I did (or it did or cosmic rays did) it happened in the last 10 days while sitting in the fireproof safe!
If you are looking for a cheap alternative done by someone that takes Darta Recovery as an hobby (and not a profession) - ME - then the fix for the ROM problem or the firmware problem would cost you, let's say $40 USD + shipping costs to and from Portugal. If a PCB is needed then the price for that must be added as well. If the problem is heads related i can't help you out and you are adviced to use the services of a professional as opening the drive in safety requires lots of experience and a clean room or laminar flow bench with class 100 filtering.
A TTL adaptor to further diagnose the problem as mention is this :
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=192
When connected to the drive on the following way it will provide further details on drive status :
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=116&t=189
Then with the use of tools like the following and with experience and knowledge the firmware problems can be fixed to regain access to the data.
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=195
Of course the MOST IMPORTANT part is to diagnose correctly the issue with the drive, so please reply to the question that i have made.
Using firmware tools or TTL will not mean a thing if the problem is with a toasted PCB or shorted TVS or bad heads, etc ....
ROM problem (damaged FIPS section) is very frequent on some models of Samsung drives. On November alone i've fix 4 of those including one for a user on the acelab forum.
Example of FIPS damage (when i had to deal with it for the first time):
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=643
Other frequent issue is when the drive develop bad sectors and those are added to the defect list overflowing the list in a way that the drive gets stuck with LED error.
Example :
Explanation on how to fix it :
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=116&t=197
Example on how it's fixed :
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=178
But again, it all depends on the exact problem of the drive and the symptoms the drive is showing. It's the main duty of people working on the data recovery field to pay close attention to those small details to do a correct assessment of what is wrong with the drive.
An extra question - when you power on the drive by connecting it directly to the PC Power suppy and SATA cable, does the drive show itself on BIOS with the correct (or not) model name ? Does it show at all ?
At this time, as near as I can tell, neither Windows 8.1 BIOS, nor windows 7 BIOS sees the drive.
I'll read through the information you posted above and see if there's something in there that can help. I may also try swapping the PCB and see if that works.
I'll report back if I have anything useful found.
Re: Recovering Data from USB drive - not initialized
January 2nd, 2015, 7:19
As a point of order.. and remembering I have not read all posts in detail as there are far more qualified/knowledgeable/experienced people here on both the electronics side and the DR Pro side...
Your BIOS is neither win8 or win7. The Motherboard has a small memory chip containing a rudimentary Operating system.. specific to the motherboard and the additions it has such as PCIe, USB ports etc. if you took all hard drives out, the BIOS would still run and I think what is asked here is if your motherboard BIOS detects the hard drive.
This could be found out by watching the POST DATA (power on self test) output if it is configured to show it, or by pressing DEL or F2 or whatever key your mobo uses to get "into the BIOS"
Win8 and Win7 are both OS's (Operating Systems) and they are both wholly contained on the hard disk in files.
In this case it is an important distinction
At this time, as near as I can tell, neither Windows 8.1 BIOS, nor windows 7 BIOS sees the drive.
Your BIOS is neither win8 or win7. The Motherboard has a small memory chip containing a rudimentary Operating system.. specific to the motherboard and the additions it has such as PCIe, USB ports etc. if you took all hard drives out, the BIOS would still run and I think what is asked here is if your motherboard BIOS detects the hard drive.
This could be found out by watching the POST DATA (power on self test) output if it is configured to show it, or by pressing DEL or F2 or whatever key your mobo uses to get "into the BIOS"
Win8 and Win7 are both OS's (Operating Systems) and they are both wholly contained on the hard disk in files.
In this case it is an important distinction
Re: Recovering Data from USB drive - not initialized
January 2nd, 2015, 14:45
Spildit wrote:First of all i would ask for the OP to plug the drive to a computer PSU and check if the drive spins at all. Then we start from there,
If the drive doesn't spin at all then there is a huge chance for the problem to be ROM related (like damaged FIPS) or electronic related. If so the chance for recovery is high.
If the drive does spin then the next question is does it produce strange or abnomal clicking or sounds normal ?
If it produces clicking or strange sounds like spindle trying to spin but without sucess or heads hitting the limiter (DO NOT OPEN THE DRIVE) then it's BAD news because most likely clean room will be needed to recover the data and it will be expensive (more than $500 USD).
If there are no strange clicking then the drive might have firmware issues like damaged A-List causing a LED error. On those cases the TTL might be of some assistence but the OP will need tools and experience to make the drive work again.
Does the drive stops after a short while after power up (if it starts to spin at all) ?
The anwser to my question might provide more clues about what is going on with the drive and if it's possible or not for you to solve it by yourself (not likely).
What you describe so far leads me to believe that the problem is not "logic" and there is some phisical issue with the drive, as stated. Either mechanical or firmaware.
Do you intend to spend any money at all to get the data recovered ?
For firmware (on the platters) problems you will need (more or less expensive) tools and the adaptor. For ROM problems you will need either firmware tools or a eeprom programmer. Buying a new PCB will not work as swaping the ROM chip might be required, unless you are lucky. So even if the problem is with the PCB buying one on ebay might not be an option unless you exactly match the firmware version. Firmware on the ROM chip of the PCB must match overlays written on platter or it will not work.
If you are looking for a cheap alternative done by someone that takes Darta Recovery as an hobby (and not a profession) - ME - then the fix for the ROM problem or the firmware problem would cost you, let's say $40 USD + shipping costs to and from Portugal. If a PCB is needed then the price for that must be added as well. If the problem is heads related i can't help you out and you are adviced to use the services of a professional as opening the drive in safety requires lots of experience and a clean room or laminar flow bench with class 100 filtering.
A TTL adaptor to further diagnose the problem as mention is this :
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=192
When connected to the drive on the following way it will provide further details on drive status :
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=116&t=189
Then with the use of tools like the following and with experience and knowledge the firmware problems can be fixed to regain access to the data.
http://malthus.mooo.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=195
Of course the MOST IMPORTANT part is to diagnose correctly the issue with the drive, so please reply to the question that i have made.
Using firmware tools or TTL will not mean a thing if the problem is with a toasted PCB or shorted TVS or bad heads, etc ....
Regards.
Spildit ,
Beautiful forums you have .Keep it up great info there
Re: Recovering Data from USB drive - not initialized
January 2nd, 2015, 15:38
I was going to post this last night, but wanted to wait for my previous reply to get approved so it would be visible...........
FIXED!
I took Spildit's information and realized I had a controller/pcb on the other Samsung drive. Swapped it onto the dead drive, and it fired up and came to life!
Transferred the whole TB of data onto one of my other backup drives and the "dead" drive is now happily spinning in the new system and showing now problems in CrystalDisk.
Apparently something in the PCB died between 12/18 and 12/28. Took the spare drive and stored it in the safe for use if one of the other 1TB Samsung drives physically fails one of these days.........
Thanks for the help. Your thoughts got me on the right track!
FIXED!
I took Spildit's information and realized I had a controller/pcb on the other Samsung drive. Swapped it onto the dead drive, and it fired up and came to life!
Transferred the whole TB of data onto one of my other backup drives and the "dead" drive is now happily spinning in the new system and showing now problems in CrystalDisk.
Apparently something in the PCB died between 12/18 and 12/28. Took the spare drive and stored it in the safe for use if one of the other 1TB Samsung drives physically fails one of these days.........
Thanks for the help. Your thoughts got me on the right track!
Re: Recovering Data from USB drive - not initialized
January 2nd, 2015, 17:00
Great result!!
Lucky, but the result is the same!
Lucky, but the result is the same!
Re: Recovering Data from USB drive - not initialized
January 3rd, 2015, 17:28
Definitely lucky... But, I've always believed it's better to be lucky than good!
Unfortunately, with my propensity to destroy hard drives, I always keep at least two sets of backups... Would'a been ok except for my stupid human trick with the new system!
Back when I was using 500GB drives I had a couple WD 500GB black drives. They ran so hot that even in a case with a fan blowing across the drives they'd get so hot you couldn't keep your hand on the drive case. In the course of 3 or 4 years I had them fail repeatedly. WD just kept replacing them. Eventually, they replaced the 500s with 640 GB drives and I never had another failure. I'm still using the 640 GB drives.
Unfortunately, with my propensity to destroy hard drives, I always keep at least two sets of backups... Would'a been ok except for my stupid human trick with the new system!
Back when I was using 500GB drives I had a couple WD 500GB black drives. They ran so hot that even in a case with a fan blowing across the drives they'd get so hot you couldn't keep your hand on the drive case. In the course of 3 or 4 years I had them fail repeatedly. WD just kept replacing them. Eventually, they replaced the 500s with 640 GB drives and I never had another failure. I'm still using the 640 GB drives.
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