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 Post subject: Silly question, MAYBE great Idea in the future
PostPosted: August 9th, 2024, 12:59 
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Joined: April 17th, 2022, 22:39
Posts: 83
Location: Vietnam
So i recently stumbled across a huge amount of SSDs in my country that uses Chinese controllers. Realtek, Raymax, Innostor, Yeestor, Asolid, Maxwell. And im trying my best to recover those SSDs.

In this line of work i've got many many cases that the problem is with the NAND chip, its gone bad that the SSD can no longer ID those NAND correctly.
However, when reading in PC3000 Flash and Flash Extractor. On a certain power, VCC, VCCq the NAND is IDable and fully readable (of course when reaching certain bad points reading directly PC3k hangs) The SSD uses mainly TSOP 48, BGA 132,152 NAND Chips

So here is my idea, silly question:
I have asked around and found out that, PC3k and FE, VNR can read those chips however there is still no way that we can write the dumps back into those chips
So why is that??
Maybe we should make a device that can write back those dumps into the NAND chips. That will definitely help with the recovery

Maybe i am wrong and still lack of knowledge
If so can anyone tell me where i thought wrong?? Maybe the NANDs are not writable for a reason?


Attachments:
File comment: IDs right when reading through PC3K, FE with Voltage modifications
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File comment: IDs wrong when on board of SSD
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6580eb143763933dca72.jpg [ 1.3 MiB | Viewed 2141 times ]
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3bdba9627515d14b8804.jpg [ 468.25 KiB | Viewed 2141 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Silly question, MAYBE great Idea in the future
PostPosted: August 9th, 2024, 13:43 
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Joined: November 7th, 2020, 5:31
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Location: United Kingdom
Who said you have to use the vcc / vccq supplied by the pmic / ICs on ssd ? :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Silly question, MAYBE great Idea in the future
PostPosted: August 9th, 2024, 13:52 
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Joined: September 8th, 2009, 18:21
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Location: Australia
"half sise" / "full sise"

:-))

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 Post subject: Re: Silly question, MAYBE great Idea in the future
PostPosted: August 10th, 2024, 4:37 
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It's almost impossible since ECC is calculated based on DATA. Unless you can manufacture a chip that is completely error-free, with an identical geometric structure, and uses the same protocol. In theory, this could be done using FPGA, but the difficulty surpasses your imagination.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly question, MAYBE great Idea in the future
PostPosted: August 10th, 2024, 12:30 
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Joined: April 17th, 2022, 22:39
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Location: Vietnam
Lardman wrote:
Who said you have to use the vcc / vccq supplied by the pmic / ICs on ssd ? :wink:


Yeah i got what you are saying, to wire vcc vccq from other source. But i don't know how?? Have you done ít? Can you shed some light?


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 Post subject: Re: Silly question, MAYBE great Idea in the future
PostPosted: August 11th, 2024, 3:13 
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Joined: October 24th, 2009, 15:22
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Location: Poland
There is several problems to have success:

1. dump quality problem
2. ECC correction. All modern SSD use LDPC
3. config problem. New chips have complicated configs, skips, mask, planes. It will be hard write back in correct way.
4. New chips are very sensitive to temperature
5. Other issues.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly question, MAYBE great Idea in the future
PostPosted: August 11th, 2024, 5:00 
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gameboybin wrote:
Yeah i got what you are saying, to wire vcc vccq from other source. But i don't know how?? Have you done ít? Can you shed some light?
All drives are different, but in general just break the power rail post generation and any feedback if you can and then feed in the voltage you want from your bench supply. Some drives get ancy about powerup order but a few reboots usually shuts them up. Nothing complicated needed.

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 Post subject: Re: Silly question, MAYBE great Idea in the future
PostPosted: August 11th, 2024, 13:40 
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In-circuit recovery of SSDs with "weak" NAND:
https://www.hddoracle.com/viewtopic.php?f=106&t=2740

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 Post subject: Re: Silly question, MAYBE great Idea in the future
PostPosted: August 11th, 2024, 21:56 
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Joined: April 17th, 2022, 22:39
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Location: Vietnam
fzabkar wrote:
In-circuit recovery of SSDs with "weak" NAND:
https://www.hddoracle.com/viewtopic.php?f=106&t=2740


U this is a nice post. Might try it out. Thanks fzabkar!


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 Post subject: Re: Silly question, MAYBE great Idea in the future
PostPosted: August 11th, 2024, 22:39 
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Joined: April 17th, 2022, 22:39
Posts: 83
Location: Vietnam
Lardman wrote:
gameboybin wrote:
Yeah i got what you are saying, to wire vcc vccq from other source. But i don't know how?? Have you done ít? Can you shed some light?
All drives are different, but in general just break the power rail post generation and any feedback if you can and then feed in the voltage you want from your bench supply. Some drives get ancy about powerup order but a few reboots usually shuts them up. Nothing complicated needed.


Can you help me out check this upper case??


Attachments:
File comment: Failed to ID chip
FAULTY 507584f54affeea1b7ee3.jpg
FAULTY 507584f54affeea1b7ee3.jpg [ 708.35 KiB | Viewed 1692 times ]
File comment: Back
507584f54affeea1b7ee3.jpg
507584f54affeea1b7ee3.jpg [ 694.46 KiB | Viewed 1692 times ]
File comment: Front
4a2299af57a5f3fbaab44.jpg
4a2299af57a5f3fbaab44.jpg [ 707.84 KiB | Viewed 1692 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Silly question, MAYBE great Idea in the future
PostPosted: August 11th, 2024, 22:44 
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Joined: April 17th, 2022, 22:39
Posts: 83
Location: Vietnam
Here is the underside with the chip taken off


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2 Kingston 256GB Back.jpg
2 Kingston 256GB Back.jpg [ 691.04 KiB | Viewed 1690 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Silly question, MAYBE great Idea in the future
PostPosted: September 2nd, 2024, 7:58 
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Joined: September 2nd, 2024, 7:51
Posts: 1
Location: New York
gameboybin, gameboybin,

A very nice, Informative article.


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