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paulr
 Post subject: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 4th, 2010, 23:08 
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Joined: December 4th, 2010, 20:42
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Location: New Jersey, USA
I have recently purchased a large size drive and was able to consolidate data from several smaller drives that i had onto it. after all my data was copied to the large drive I began to run my old drives through some tests and found some unusual problems with 2 different types of hdd software which im sure you guys know. HDD Scan and HD Tune. both of these programs show fairly the same thing and since HD Tune makes it easy for me to export data i will use it to show the interesting results below. What is interesting about those results is that they are both from 2 different drives that are the same make and model. I used one for a boot drive in one computer and the other i used as a external usb backup drive and that drive was used a lot less but seeing from the results you can see that the smart data is exactly the same and its from 2 different drives.

drive 1:

Code:
HD Tune Pro: WDC WD2500JB-00GVA0      Health

ID                                  Current  Worst    ThresholdData     Status   
(01) Raw Read Error Rate            199      199      51       30       ok       
(03) Spin Up Time                   120      116      21       6541     ok       
(04) Start/Stop Count               92       92       40       8291     ok       
(05) Reallocated Sector Count       197      197      140      42       warning 
(07) Seek Error Rate                200      200      51       0        ok       
(09) Power On Hours Count           87       87       0        9773     ok       
(0A) Spin Retry Count               100      100      51       0        ok       
(0B) Calibration Retry Count        100      100      51       0        ok       
(0C) Power Cycle Count              100      100      0        912      ok       
(C2) Temperature                    111      85       0        39       ok       
(C4) Reallocated Event Count        194      194      0        6        warning 
(C5) Current Pending Sector         200      200      0        2        warning 
(C6) Offline Uncorrectable          200      200      0        15       ok       
(C7) Ultra DMA CRC Error Count      200      253      0        5311     warning 
(C8) Write Error Rate               200      200      51       1        ok       

Health Status         : warning



drive 2

Code:

HD Tune Pro: WDC WD2500JB-00FUA0      Health

ID                                  Current  Worst    ThresholdData     Status   
(01) Raw Read Error Rate            199      199      51       30       ok       
(03) Spin Up Time                   120      116      21       6541     ok       
(04) Start/Stop Count               92       92       40       8291     ok       
(05) Reallocated Sector Count       197      197      140      42       warning 
(07) Seek Error Rate                200      200      51       0        ok       
(09) Power On Hours Count           87       87       0        9773     ok       
(0A) Spin Retry Count               100      100      51       0        ok       
(0B) Calibration Retry Count        100      100      51       0        ok       
(0C) Power Cycle Count              100      100      0        912      ok       
(C2) Temperature                    109      85       0        41       ok       
(C4) Reallocated Event Count        194      194      0        6        warning 
(C5) Current Pending Sector         200      200      0        2        warning 
(C6) Offline Uncorrectable          200      200      0        15       ok       
(C7) Ultra DMA CRC Error Count      200      253      0        5311     warning 
(C8) Write Error Rate               200      200      51       1        ok       

Health Status         : warning



What im thinking is that both of these drives either failed very early on in their life and failed exactly the same way although they were used totally different amount and for different purpose or both are pre programmed with this smart data from factory as failures.
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poehere
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 5th, 2010, 2:34 
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Joined: February 27th, 2009, 3:26
Posts: 1721
Location: French Polynesia Tahiti
I might suggest to get a true reading on this one you can use MHDD it is here on teh forum and might give you a better idea of what is really wrong on your drives and if they really have SMART issues on them. You can also do zero fill on these drives to try and correct some of the errors and there is remapping of bad sectors too. Give this one a try it is a good software package and many people use it here and have really good results from it.

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BlackST
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 5th, 2010, 3:13 
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Joined: July 18th, 2006, 3:05
Posts: 7476
Location: ITALY
You bought two cheap drives that will fail regardless of SMART, in my opinion. In a nutshell, some SW can effectively mis-interpretate some atts, but in your case there are small problems. I have a radical solution but it is not doable by end user. The best you can do is what poehere said - zerofill. Something change, in better or worse, but change.
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drc
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 6th, 2010, 10:20 
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Joined: August 12th, 2008, 13:11
Posts: 3235
Location: USA
It looks to me like your program is incorrectly polling the same drive twice; no way it would really match 100% except for temp like that

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paulr
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 6th, 2010, 14:52 
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Joined: December 4th, 2010, 20:42
Posts: 6
Location: New Jersey, USA
I dont see these drives as cheap. They served me well for many years and still do but i just wanted to check them over before i put them to use in one of my computers and thats when i noticed this. And since both drives were used for different tasks and they both appear exactly the same except for temperature I doubt that the drives have actual problems. Anyway, I downloaded the mhdd iso and booted with it and the program starts but i don't see any option that says zero fill. There is a initscsi command that seems to format the drive but i have not tried it.
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paulr
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 6th, 2010, 14:55 
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Joined: December 4th, 2010, 20:42
Posts: 6
Location: New Jersey, USA
drc wrote:
It looks to me like your program is incorrectly polling the same drive twice; no way it would really match 100% except for temp like that

hddscan shows the same thing except for temperature.
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BlackST
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 6th, 2010, 15:47 
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Joined: July 18th, 2006, 3:05
Posts: 7476
Location: ITALY
About MHDD, re-read the manual.

About your WD drives , it's my opinion based on my work and on technical facts. I don't use them. MY opinion. Period.
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drc
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 6th, 2010, 15:48 
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Joined: August 12th, 2008, 13:11
Posts: 3235
Location: USA
paulr wrote:
drc wrote:
It looks to me like your program is incorrectly polling the same drive twice; no way it would really match 100% except for temp like that

hddscan shows the same thing except for temperature.

Well, perhaps it is your hardware configuration. I would suggest using MHDD (i.e. something not windows based) and examining the drives with only one hooked up at a time

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fzabkar
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 7th, 2010, 3:32 
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Joined: September 8th, 2009, 18:21
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Location: Australia
Is this some kind of strange RAID issue???

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guru
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 7th, 2010, 5:11 
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Joined: May 5th, 2004, 20:06
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The OP said "I used one for a boot drive in one computer and the other i used as a external usb backup drive "

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All went well until I plugged the drive in.
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fzabkar
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 7th, 2010, 6:02 
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I saw that, but I thought that when he consolidated the data, he may have installed both old drives inside the new machine.

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paulr
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 7th, 2010, 12:11 
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Joined: December 4th, 2010, 20:42
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Location: New Jersey, USA
Yes i have the 2 drives in 1 machine now but not in hardware raid setup. I also have them as dynamic disks in stripped mode in windows xp but this will not affect smart data when its pulled from each drive separately. Either way i get the same warnings in hd tune with only one drive connected. but i have been somewhat busy this week to try some of the things mentioned here as that requires me to unplug my working drive and then plug in the 2 drives with the problems for me to do any more trouble shooting. but I will play around with mhdd some more when i get a chance. Thanks to you guys for your suggestions.
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guru
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 8th, 2010, 10:17 
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Maybe both drives were on the same IDE ribbon cable.. I know I'm pulling at straws now

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paulr
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 8th, 2010, 12:12 
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Joined: December 4th, 2010, 20:42
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Location: New Jersey, USA
They are definitely on their own cable but running from a separate ata133 controller too. The smart data shows the same regardless of how and how many I plug in at the same time. I'm really thinking those values were set like that from the factory. I wish I knew about hddtune when i got the drives new so i would know if this smart data was the same back then.
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drc
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 8th, 2010, 12:17 
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Location: USA
paulr wrote:
I'm really thinking those values were set like that from the factory.

That doesn't make any sense

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paulr
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 8th, 2010, 12:42 
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Joined: December 4th, 2010, 20:42
Posts: 6
Location: New Jersey, USA
I know it doesnt make sense. Thats why I decided to register on this site and ask questions. I consider myself as a advanced computer technician and i can solve pretty much any computer related problem except this one was a bit strange. But like i said earlier it doesnt appear to be a problem it just may have been this way since the beginning when i got those drives. Or the other possibillity is that they were lemons right from the production line.
Ok so what exactly should i do in MHDD to diagnose these drives as having a definite problems? I know every drive has a defect list so im not concerned with that but i would like to know if there is a way to tell if there are any new defects that were not originally marked when the drive was new. Also, what in the MHDD program will tell me that they are really on their way to a slow death?
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poehere
 Post subject: Re: can SMART data be interpreted incorrectly by SMART software
PostPosted: December 9th, 2010, 3:27 
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Joined: February 27th, 2009, 3:26
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Location: French Polynesia Tahiti
There is a manual for MHDD. Download it and read it. Tells you how to use this software. This one will be a good indication if there really is problems on these drives. Instead of worrying about this other software use what we do to see what your drive is doing. Many people use this and find really good results with it. Try it and tells us what you find out. BTW WD is crap and I would not suggest you buy too many again. Try changing brands and I do not suggest Seagate either on this one.

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