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 Post subject: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 3:43 
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Joined: March 12th, 2009, 18:31
Posts: 32
Location: Sweden
Hi,

As a newby I am searching for a data recovery course and are considerating the $3000 distance learning classes from Scott Moulton - MyHardDriveDied.
The course exists of Video, Books and Data Recovery Tools.

Is there anybody on this forum that has followed the same course?

Do you have suggestions for other distance or on-place trainings?

Grateful for yor experiences,

Edsel

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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 4:51 
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Joined: October 13th, 2008, 7:29
Posts: 1493
Personally, I would rather spend $3000 on a trip to Disney World. You might have more success being trained by Donald Duck, thats just my opinion. He is one of the main reasons why we have to answer countless posts about moving platters and DIY data recovery.


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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 6:01 
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Joined: July 18th, 2006, 3:05
Posts: 7476
Location: ITALY
You can achieve the same result spending 1/100...


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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 6:24 
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Joined: November 9th, 2006, 15:15
Posts: 2984
edsel wrote:
Hi,

As a newby I am searching for a data recovery course and are considerating the $3000 distance learning classes from Scott Moulton - MyHardDriveDied.
The course exists of Video, Books and Data Recovery Tools.


There are some things that cant simply be taught, you cant learn experience.

If you do pay for the training be sure you can come back here to let us all know how it was and what you learned.

We do like a laugh :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 7:01 
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Joined: August 8th, 2007, 6:32
Posts: 1238
Location: inside ROM
DR money cant buy, its all based on experiment and experience.


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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 7:04 
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Joined: July 13th, 2007, 1:17
Posts: 149
Guarantee you Scott must be here somewhere in this forum hiding, well he is a Dic# He$%! :evil: I will teach you half of what he offered you. :D


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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 7:13 
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Joined: March 12th, 2009, 18:31
Posts: 32
Location: Sweden
Well, these answers are not very helpfull!

I don't like Disney World and if I can get know-how for 1/100th of the price please tell me where and how.

I already know that I cannot buy experience but I am new in DR and want to gather some fundamental knowledge.
So I am searching a way to buy somebody elses his experience - in other words a training course.

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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 7:22 
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Joined: July 18th, 2006, 3:05
Posts: 7476
Location: ITALY
Instead of learning how to f... drives for sure, save the money, invest only some bucks in porn DVDs at least there will be something to learn how to f... something HEALTHIER and WORTHER and BETTER WAY.

Sorry couldn't resist. :mrgreen:

Now seriously... there are better ways to start a DR busine$$. If I should base on what I see on the net everyday and on the silly questions heard and answered, this is my opinion. You have received some opinions from reputable and trusted pros here, wait for some more and you can decide.
Moreover, you'll need clean room equipment and HW work and diagnostic tools, don't forget it. Or are you planning to do everything in your garage with a multimeter and a soldering iron bought from the nearest HW store and some freeware software ? Come on...


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 Post subject: About Data Recovery Training
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 7:28 
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Joined: October 19th, 2006, 11:56
Posts: 217
No Comments...

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I just hate spammers...It was a Spammer, who ruined my life!


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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 8:05 
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Joined: November 9th, 2006, 15:15
Posts: 2984
HeadCrash wrote:
Guarantee you Scott must be here somewhere in this forum hiding, well he is a Dic# He$%! :evil: I will teach you half of what he offered you. :D


I would like Scott to show himself here, would be good to hear his opinions on things and give a true reflection of how competent he would be to learn from.

I personally do not think any training he has to offer will have much relevance. I watched the MyHardDriveDied video and not a whole lot of it seemed consistent with facts.

I believe it is Scott who says platterswaps cannot be performed on drives with multiple platters among other things!!


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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 8:52 
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Joined: August 9th, 2007, 8:40
Posts: 791
Location: United Kingdom
Edsel,

Would you pay 3000 USD for a distance learning course on 'how to play golf' or 'how to be an expert chef' or 'whatever you can think of' and expect to be a professional once you have finished the course ?

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If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, you probably don't fully understand the situation. ... Mr Kipling

https://www.mjm.co.uk/


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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 9:00 
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Joined: June 8th, 2006, 19:44
Posts: 3144
Location: Atlanta, GA
I've met with Scott on a casual basis (he works nearby) and I like him. He's very cordial --- always helpful and friendly. I've not taken his course, nor have I visited his facility, so I can't say anything about those things.

The D.R. industry is very secretive. Our business is recovering data. Scott's business, to some extent, is selling information. Understandably, a lot of pros feel threatened by that. Oh well.

This is the internet age, and it is almost impossible to prevent the spread of knowledge and information. Undoubtedly, some of that info will be wrong.

Back to training. I took the DeepSpar course and found it quite helpful. As has been pointed out, there is no substitute for experience. There is only so much you can learn in less than a week in a group setting. However, it really did boost my overall confidence. Unlike Scott's course, the physical aspects of mechanical repair (other than compatibility info) were not presented. In any event, the DeepSpar people are pros and know their stuff.

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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 10:01 
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Joined: October 14th, 2005, 9:26
Posts: 1060
Hi, After to make the course counts its experience to us and what it really learned, thus it helps the next ones. :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 10:49 
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Joined: March 12th, 2009, 18:31
Posts: 32
Location: Sweden
Thanks for your reply, jono-ats.

Edsel

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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 12:01 
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Joined: May 4th, 2007, 8:23
Posts: 74
Location: UK
The answer to the question 'should I spend $3000 on a course for data recovery' is No.

The question ' How do I get into this industry' is buy the equipment, invest in some very experienced technicians, spend a fortune on marketing and take it from there.

If you are trying to do this on the cheap. Dont. You WILL fail.

If you are serious, employ an expert and learn from them. If you are really serious, employ 2 or 3 experts and learn from them all.

In the UK, there is a Data Recovery course for Police Officers. They simply use Encase! It really winds me up - because many of them think that they are experts!

Whatever you decide, good luck, just dont scrimp, invest properly. If you cant afford to, choose a different career path.

Regards,

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Simon

http://www.disklabs.com

International Professional Data Recovery Association


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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 12:11 
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Joined: August 9th, 2007, 8:40
Posts: 791
Location: United Kingdom
Quote:
In the UK, there is a Data Recovery course for Police Officers. They simply use Encase!


The thing is, Simon, that there is Data Recovery as we know it and Data Recovery in the forensics field. If we were looking for a few paragraphs of text or the odd photo to prove something had happened, then Encase will do it (as will other programs).. If however, the customer needs all the data on the drive that just fell down the stairs, that is another kettle of fish... Strange thing is, the easier of the two pays better :)

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If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, you probably don't fully understand the situation. ... Mr Kipling

https://www.mjm.co.uk/


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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 12:55 
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Joined: September 29th, 2005, 12:02
Posts: 3577
Location: Chicago
Disklabs wrote:
In the UK, there is a Data Recovery course for Police Officers. They simply use Encase!

it's called Data Discovery

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SAN, NAS, RAID, Server, and HDD Data Recovery.


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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 13:25 
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Joined: July 18th, 2006, 3:05
Posts: 7476
Location: ITALY
Just don't get why everyone is trying to start DR... :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 7th, 2009, 20:06 
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Joined: October 3rd, 2005, 0:40
Posts: 4753
Location: Hungary
yeah

the people building my house apparently rip my pants off with 8-10 hours work a day :) I really began to doubt I chose the best field to live on.... I should have chosen to build houses... then I had houses as many drives I have now... :)
DR is hard and sometimes does not return the invested time. At least here.
But it is interesting on the other hand to deal with unique cases each day.

pepe

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 Post subject: Re: Your experiences with Data Recovery Courses
PostPosted: April 8th, 2009, 0:41 
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Joined: April 7th, 2009, 23:59
Posts: 11
Location: Atlanta, Ga
There are a few things I would like to say.
The first I will say is the same thing I tell anyone that takes a class, or asks me. I never said I was the best, I never said I knew it all. I tell everyone that it is all about research, experience and persistence. The important part is persistence. If you don’t keep trying you will never get it. All I am teaching people are the things I have learned and how to do some of the research to accomplish it on your own.

When I do a presentation that gets video taped and posted, and you see it, you have to understand in 50 minutes there is no way to cover everything, so like most presenters you gloss over some things, and focus on the topic and sometimes it will get misconstrued. The speech about doing multi-platters was my first DEFCON speech and in front of 3000 people. The goal was the DIY recovery. I told people that there was not a way for them to do a multi-platter DIY, so that I did not take them out and screw up the drive. I did not go into the more advanced Multi-Platter tool until the next year to answer the questions that were asked, not that IT did not exist or was not possible.

It is one of the downsides of doing a 50 minute complicated speech. However, I welcome someone else stepping up and doing a presentation even if the point was to debunk what I am saying. Please do, I would love to learn more. But so far, I don’t see anyone sharing. Feel free to come to DEFCON, or maybe publish your own videos.

However, in the classes I go into way more detail. My class is not for everyone. It is a beginner’s course for people that have never done a head replacement or swapped platters. I cover clean rooms, head combs, how to make your own tools, and during class I show people how I would replace a head assembly. I cover some basics of the PC3000, DeepSpar Disk Imager, and dozens of other tools. The point is the introduction of what the basics are. In the class the students rebuild 6 hard drives by tearing them down to bear metal and then rebuilding them to a working state and recovering files from them. By the 4th day, generally 90% of the class can make their own head combs from foil, and rebuild them to a working state again. That is quite an accomplishment that I think most would agree. I am there to help and just to show what I would do.

Now in addition to that, I am a forensic expert. I have worked on cases, federal trials, testified in federal court about “forensics” and data. I know the MFT and can reconstruct records by hand. I can get the job done, and when it comes to taking the data apart and rebuilding it, I have done that for over a decade. I don’t need to go into all that here, there is plenty of evidence to back up that I know what to do with the data and how to reconstruct all the major OS’s and find the evidence. For example, when the Fat table has a file deleted in Windows the sequence numbers are stomped on. But in some versions of Linux when a file is deleted on fat it destroys the 11th byte, which is the indicator for a long file name, which should never change. So you can tell from the data and how it was changed even what OS it was done from by a single Byte. There is also some other issues with file names and date time stamps that most people never seem to know about or any tool covers. These are also some things I cover in the class since a portion of the class also does forensics.

All I am saying is information should be shared, and if you are skilled, you will still be skilled after you help someone. If you are not part of the solution you are part of the problem.

Most of you respond with there is no way to learn it, or send it to me and for $2000 I will fix it. That info is not very helpful to say, people working at the FBI, or the IRS. One thing that most of you tech people don’t know is how to communicate with other people and get your point across. If you look above, there is no detail because all people do is say everything is crap. I will tell you there are things to learn and people can build on the base. Why don’t you help the community you are a part of. Hard drives have been around 30 years, so why is it all still a black art? Be the guy that people come to for information. Do a presentation, learn how to communicate, share your knowledge. Don't wait for someone else, you are someone.

Since all the responses never seem to know anything about my class there is a fairly famous forensic person who has written many many books and knows plenty about the job required. His name is well respected, Dave Kleiman. Look here for him. http://davekleiman.com/

He wrote an article after taking my class, which you can see below. One thing I will say, that no one here seems to be offering, is help for people who want to know.

http://computerforensicexaminer.com/com ... xperience/

Scott A. Moulton
SANS Instructor for SEC606
Forensic Data Recovery
http://www.sans.org/info/37599


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